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1.) billy b - 08/25/2014
Got an e-mail today, I drew a hunt 6 miles from my house on a super Texas Parks & Wildlife area. This will be the first time I have ever hunted E. Texas, and this is a great area for big bucks. Since I only live 5 minutes away I will do some heavy scouting.
2.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
:-)
Great!
I'm looking forward to you showing Luv2 how it's done! :wink
Is it a multi-day or all-season permit?
Great!
I'm looking forward to you showing Luv2 how it's done! :wink
Is it a multi-day or all-season permit?
3.) billy b - 08/26/2014
5 day, Oct 27-31.
4.) DParker - 08/26/2014
Get off my lawn!!!!!
5.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
:groan:[QUOTE=billy b;23630]5 day, Oct 27-31.[/QUOTE]
I guess if I'd read your headline with my brain on, I could have figured it out...:bang:
:duh:
I like the idea of a five-day hunt. All I know of is three-day draws around here.
I guess if I'd read your headline with my brain on, I could have figured it out...:bang:
:duh:
I like the idea of a five-day hunt. All I know of is three-day draws around here.
6.) billy b - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=DParker;23631]Get off my lawn!!!!![/QUOTE]
Did you draw out ????
Did you draw out ????
7.) DParker - 08/26/2014
Richland Creek archery deer? I didn't know any of the archery hunts were 5 days. I put in for the Abilene SP one, which is 3 days (actually, 2 days of hunting spread over 3 days, like yours will be 4 days of actual hunting spread over 5 days.)
8.) billy b - 08/26/2014
I know the Game Wardens plus I am handicapped ya know:wink
9.) DParker - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=billy b;23633]Did you draw out ????[/QUOTE]
I'm not sure. My online status for the Abilene SP hunt says "Pending 2nd Draw", whatever that means.
And the rifle hunts haven't drawn yet.
I'm not sure. My online status for the Abilene SP hunt says "Pending 2nd Draw", whatever that means.
And the rifle hunts haven't drawn yet.
10.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
Handicapped like a fox...:wink
11.) DParker - 08/26/2014
If they still allow you to express a preference, go for the pipeline easement. Deer wander up and down the edge of it, and about 250 yds or so from the road, on the right side of the easement is a little opening where hogs come in and out at dawn/dusk. At least, they did when I was there.
12.) Floyd - 08/26/2014
Explain 2 days of hunting spread out over 3 days, please.
13.) Floyd - 08/26/2014
Need a hunting buddy Billy?
14.) DParker - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Floyd;23639]Explain 2 days of hunting spread out over 3 days, please.[/QUOTE]
They typically (well, always, on every hunt I've been drawn for) split a day's hunt into two halves: One in the early AM and one in the late afternoon. The first morning is spent on check-in, filling vacancies from stand-by hunters (if any) and orientation. Then you'll have the first afternoon hunt. The last day consists of the morning hunt that you didn't get the first day, then you're done. The days in between (if any) consist of both morning and afternoon hunts.
So, [i]n[/I] days worth of hunting spread over [I]n[/I] + 1 calendar days.
They typically (well, always, on every hunt I've been drawn for) split a day's hunt into two halves: One in the early AM and one in the late afternoon. The first morning is spent on check-in, filling vacancies from stand-by hunters (if any) and orientation. Then you'll have the first afternoon hunt. The last day consists of the morning hunt that you didn't get the first day, then you're done. The days in between (if any) consist of both morning and afternoon hunts.
So, [i]n[/I] days worth of hunting spread over [I]n[/I] + 1 calendar days.
15.) billy b - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Floyd;23640]Need a hunting buddy Billy?[/QUOTE]
I don't think I can have a buddy on this hunt.
I don't think I can have a buddy on this hunt.
16.) DParker - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=billy b;23642]I don't think I can have a buddy on this hunt.[/QUOTE]
Nope, not unless they were listed along with you on the application.
Nope, not unless they were listed along with you on the application.
17.) Floyd - 08/26/2014
Ah-so
Doumo arigatou
Doumo arigatou
18.) billy b - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=DParker;23643]Nope, not unless they were listed along with you on the application.[/QUOTE]
I didn't see a place to add a buddy on the app.
I didn't see a place to add a buddy on the app.
19.) DParker - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Floyd;23644]Ah-so
Doumo arigatou[/QUOTE]
Pasta Ragu. :tu:
[QUOTE=billy b;23645]I didn't see a place to add a buddy on the app.[/QUOTE]
Did you enter online, or mail-in? The mail-in forms have lines on the bottom for extra names & SSNs. The online system displays a button for adding another name once you've entered your own info, though all names on the app have to have their own account on the TPWD web site.
Doumo arigatou[/QUOTE]
Pasta Ragu. :tu:
[QUOTE=billy b;23645]I didn't see a place to add a buddy on the app.[/QUOTE]
Did you enter online, or mail-in? The mail-in forms have lines on the bottom for extra names & SSNs. The online system displays a button for adding another name once you've entered your own info, though all names on the app have to have their own account on the TPWD web site.
20.) billy b - 08/26/2014
I did it on line, I didn't see an add on, but mind is only half functioning nowadays.:bang:
21.) Triton Rich - 08/26/2014
[B]Sounds great Billy! Now, up here in N IL, the end of Oct usually means some heavy seeking and chasing. So down there in TX I suppose they'll still be in the laying around eating and getting fat phase right? :-)[/B]
22.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
What's this n + 1 calendar day, = half day check in crap???
billy come hunt with me, where 1 day still = 1 freaking day. If you need any tips on how to do improper stand placement or massively invasive scouting techniques let me know.
Good luck but I'm so going to clean your clock this year, you silly Texan you.:tu:
billy come hunt with me, where 1 day still = 1 freaking day. If you need any tips on how to do improper stand placement or massively invasive scouting techniques let me know.
Good luck but I'm so going to clean your clock this year, you silly Texan you.:tu:
23.) billy b - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Triton Rich;23648][B]Sounds great Billy! Now, up here in N IL, the end of Oct usually means some heavy seeking and chasing. So down there in TX I suppose they'll still be in the laying around eating and getting fat phase right? :-)[/B][/QUOTE]
You are correct Rich, the groups will be broken up & scraping will be going on, but mostly just grazing.
You are correct Rich, the groups will be broken up & scraping will be going on, but mostly just grazing.
24.) billy b - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23649]What's this n + 1 calendar day, = half day check in crap???
billy come hunt with me, where 1 day still = 1 freaking day. If you need any tips on how to do improper stand placement or massively invasive scouting techniques let me know.
Good luck but I'm so going to clean your clock this year, you silly Texan you.:tu:[/QUOTE]
Don't worry about that Jerry, at least I remember how to kill one, how long has it been for you?????:cf::grin:
billy come hunt with me, where 1 day still = 1 freaking day. If you need any tips on how to do improper stand placement or massively invasive scouting techniques let me know.
Good luck but I'm so going to clean your clock this year, you silly Texan you.:tu:[/QUOTE]
Don't worry about that Jerry, at least I remember how to kill one, how long has it been for you?????:cf::grin:
25.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
n + 1 day - check in X a2 = y + x scrape - (rubline n + 3 half days) X .5 acres = gut pile
Pay attention, you're going to need to know this crap to kill a deer down there. Come hunt with me, we just show up in our camo and climb the freaking tree.
Pay attention, you're going to need to know this crap to kill a deer down there. Come hunt with me, we just show up in our camo and climb the freaking tree.
26.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
5 day hunt = 3 calendar half days, less gas money. What a load of crap.:wink
27.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23649]...If you need any tips on how to do improper stand placement or massively invasive scouting techniques let me know.
Good luck but I'm so going to clean your clock this year, you silly Texan you.:tu:[/QUOTE]
I was thinking of your invasive scouting techniques just the other day...:wink
Good luck but I'm so going to clean your clock this year, you silly Texan you.:tu:[/QUOTE]
I was thinking of your invasive scouting techniques just the other day...:wink
28.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
As a matter of fact, you should pull that thread up. I looked for it for a little while but haven't come with it yet. I remember I assigned an insulting name for your technique, but can't think of it right now...:wink
Wish I knew how to work the Wayback Machine...:-):wave:
Wish I knew how to work the Wayback Machine...:-):wave:
29.) Triton Rich - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=billy b;23650]You are correct Rich, the groups will be broken up & scraping will be going on, but mostly just grazing.[/QUOTE]
[B] Good, then there is still some hope of them following a bit of a pattern :wink [/B]
[B] Good, then there is still some hope of them following a bit of a pattern :wink [/B]
30.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
We'll just start it over again.
Think about it though. Studies show mature bucks don't mysteriously move their core area. They move around at various times, the rut for example, where they venture off for a spell. But they always come back to the core area.
So what are they going to do with you walking around the entire 250-300 acre hunting area? Leave? If you walk over the entire area you've bumped them, more than once probably. Do you suggest they will abandon the core area and strike off for places unknown?
They will go nocturnal I suppose with too much activity, but I am finding they already are nocturnal here to a large degree. So no real change there IMO. I wonder if you've been everywhere once (note once-not 50 times), if you simply can't or won't be patterned by them.
More studies required at this point.
Think about it though. Studies show mature bucks don't mysteriously move their core area. They move around at various times, the rut for example, where they venture off for a spell. But they always come back to the core area.
So what are they going to do with you walking around the entire 250-300 acre hunting area? Leave? If you walk over the entire area you've bumped them, more than once probably. Do you suggest they will abandon the core area and strike off for places unknown?
They will go nocturnal I suppose with too much activity, but I am finding they already are nocturnal here to a large degree. So no real change there IMO. I wonder if you've been everywhere once (note once-not 50 times), if you simply can't or won't be patterned by them.
More studies required at this point.
31.) bluecat - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;23666]
Wish I knew how to work the Wayback machine...:-):wave:[/QUOTE]
You and Tara Reid
Wish I knew how to work the Wayback machine...:-):wave:[/QUOTE]
You and Tara Reid
32.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
LOL...
I'm actually impressed and a little frightened you knew how to find that...:p
I'm actually impressed and a little frightened you knew how to find that...:p
33.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Triton Rich;23668][B] Good, then there is still some hope of them following a bit of a pattern :wink [/B][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23669]...
Think about it though. Studies show mature bucks don't mysteriously move their core area. They move around at various times, the rut for example, where they venture off for a spell. But they always come back to the core area.
So what are they going to do with you walking around the entire 250-300 acre hunting area? Leave? If you walk over the entire area you've bumped them, more than once probably. Do you suggest they will abandon the core area and strike off for places unknown?
...I wonder if you've been everywhere once (note once-not 50 times), if you simply can't or won't be patterned by them...[/QUOTE]
Wait, Luv2...I thought you were a fan of going everywhere 50 times... :tap: :wink
You've set up a bit of a false choice, if I take you literally. Deer can stay in their core areas and still alter their behavior enough because of improper pressure so you can't kill them.
Whether that means deer were disturbed enough to "pattern" you is a slightly different question.
"Going nocturnal" whether naturally or by hunter-inducement is one thing. Putting deer on alert and disrupting their patterns is another. Bucks may not leave their core areas, but why run the risk of disrupting their pattern (when and if you can find one) and/or have to go find them/pattern them again after you've bumped them?
Resting areas between intrusions is about the best solution I can think of. You've alerted deer to your presence. Now let them forget a little.
I'm not convinced I always know where the line is or how to apply it in the real world. Pre-season prep and in-season adjustment have always been necessary for me. Maybe some guys can hang a couple of stands in May and be done with it, but that's not the way it works here.
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23669]...
Think about it though. Studies show mature bucks don't mysteriously move their core area. They move around at various times, the rut for example, where they venture off for a spell. But they always come back to the core area.
So what are they going to do with you walking around the entire 250-300 acre hunting area? Leave? If you walk over the entire area you've bumped them, more than once probably. Do you suggest they will abandon the core area and strike off for places unknown?
...I wonder if you've been everywhere once (note once-not 50 times), if you simply can't or won't be patterned by them...[/QUOTE]
Wait, Luv2...I thought you were a fan of going everywhere 50 times... :tap: :wink
You've set up a bit of a false choice, if I take you literally. Deer can stay in their core areas and still alter their behavior enough because of improper pressure so you can't kill them.
Whether that means deer were disturbed enough to "pattern" you is a slightly different question.
"Going nocturnal" whether naturally or by hunter-inducement is one thing. Putting deer on alert and disrupting their patterns is another. Bucks may not leave their core areas, but why run the risk of disrupting their pattern (when and if you can find one) and/or have to go find them/pattern them again after you've bumped them?
Resting areas between intrusions is about the best solution I can think of. You've alerted deer to your presence. Now let them forget a little.
I'm not convinced I always know where the line is or how to apply it in the real world. Pre-season prep and in-season adjustment have always been necessary for me. Maybe some guys can hang a couple of stands in May and be done with it, but that's not the way it works here.
34.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;23673]Resting areas between intrusions is about the best solution I can think of. You've alerted deer to your presence. Now let them forget a little.....Pre-season prep and in-season adjustment have always been necessary for me.[/QUOTE]
So I'm assuming you are only scouting certain areas on the property and leaving other areas alone. How are you finding these areas and scouting them without covering the entire property? I think we're talking about essentially the same thing but in different terms.
Here's what I'm suggesting should never be done. Let's agree to agree or disagree on this first. If you have a 10 acre honey hole, favorite spot on your hunting land (who doesn't?), going there to scout, hanging a camera, setting a stand, coming back to hunt, on this one spot only, is a bad idea. Any mature buck that has his wits about him is going to know human activity is focused on this one area.
Unless there is something tipping the scale in your favor he's going to avoid that area over time. I'm sure we agree on that....I think.
What would he do if there were equal scouting, stand hanging practices going on over his entire core area? Again not suggesting you cover the entire area every week or even every other week. I think it comes down to whether or not we should leave 'sanctuary' areas on the property.
Do you think we should do that?
So I'm assuming you are only scouting certain areas on the property and leaving other areas alone. How are you finding these areas and scouting them without covering the entire property? I think we're talking about essentially the same thing but in different terms.
Here's what I'm suggesting should never be done. Let's agree to agree or disagree on this first. If you have a 10 acre honey hole, favorite spot on your hunting land (who doesn't?), going there to scout, hanging a camera, setting a stand, coming back to hunt, on this one spot only, is a bad idea. Any mature buck that has his wits about him is going to know human activity is focused on this one area.
Unless there is something tipping the scale in your favor he's going to avoid that area over time. I'm sure we agree on that....I think.
What would he do if there were equal scouting, stand hanging practices going on over his entire core area? Again not suggesting you cover the entire area every week or even every other week. I think it comes down to whether or not we should leave 'sanctuary' areas on the property.
Do you think we should do that?
35.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Triton Rich;23668][B] Good, then there is still some hope of them following a bit of a pattern :wink [/B][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23674]So I'm assuming you are only scouting certain areas on the property and leaving other areas alone. How are you finding these areas and scouting them without covering the entire property? I think we're talking about essentially the same thing but in different terms. [/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]
I don't know about you, but I came here for an argument. :wink
I find the areas I would leave alone by map and previous experience. I'm more likely to leave an area alone that I've identified as a bedding/cover/sanctuary zone or a feeding area while I concentrate on finding the travel corridors, such as they are in flatland and/or big woods. How to find the small bow-friendly area within an area where you are most likely to find deer drawn by food or cover is the tricky part, especially if you believe, as I do, that deer are likely to bed anywhere they please in my woods. [/COLOR]
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23674] Here's what I'm suggesting should never be done. Let's agree to agree or disagree on this first. If you have a 10 acre honey hole, favorite spot on your hunting land (who doesn't?), going there to scout, hanging a camera, setting a stand, coming back to hunt, on this one spot only, is a bad idea. Any mature buck that has his wits about him is going to know human activity is focused on this one area.
Unless there is something tipping the scale in your favor he's going to avoid that area over time. I'm sure we agree on that....I think.[/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Right.[/COLOR]
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23674] What would he do if there were equal scouting, stand hanging practices going on over his entire core area? Again not suggesting you cover the entire area every week or even every other week. I think it comes down to whether or not we should leave 'sanctuary' areas on the property. [/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Bingo.[/COLOR]
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23674] Do you think we should do that? [/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Yes. Sanctuary area here is unlikely to be huntable anyway. If you accept that, what more is there to be learned once you recognize it as sanctuary? Shed hunting in March is permissible. :wink Otherwise you do more harm than good in there. [/COLOR]
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23674]So I'm assuming you are only scouting certain areas on the property and leaving other areas alone. How are you finding these areas and scouting them without covering the entire property? I think we're talking about essentially the same thing but in different terms. [/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]
I don't know about you, but I came here for an argument. :wink
I find the areas I would leave alone by map and previous experience. I'm more likely to leave an area alone that I've identified as a bedding/cover/sanctuary zone or a feeding area while I concentrate on finding the travel corridors, such as they are in flatland and/or big woods. How to find the small bow-friendly area within an area where you are most likely to find deer drawn by food or cover is the tricky part, especially if you believe, as I do, that deer are likely to bed anywhere they please in my woods. [/COLOR]
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23674] Here's what I'm suggesting should never be done. Let's agree to agree or disagree on this first. If you have a 10 acre honey hole, favorite spot on your hunting land (who doesn't?), going there to scout, hanging a camera, setting a stand, coming back to hunt, on this one spot only, is a bad idea. Any mature buck that has his wits about him is going to know human activity is focused on this one area.
Unless there is something tipping the scale in your favor he's going to avoid that area over time. I'm sure we agree on that....I think.[/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Right.[/COLOR]
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23674] What would he do if there were equal scouting, stand hanging practices going on over his entire core area? Again not suggesting you cover the entire area every week or even every other week. I think it comes down to whether or not we should leave 'sanctuary' areas on the property. [/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Bingo.[/COLOR]
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23674] Do you think we should do that? [/QUOTE]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Yes. Sanctuary area here is unlikely to be huntable anyway. If you accept that, what more is there to be learned once you recognize it as sanctuary? Shed hunting in March is permissible. :wink Otherwise you do more harm than good in there. [/COLOR]
36.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23674]...What would he do if there were equal scouting, stand hanging practices going on over his entire core area? Again not suggesting you cover the entire area every week or even every other week...
[/QUOTE]
I'll tell you what he'd do in my area...Speaking of a buck of at least 2 1/2, he'd learn to sit tight in thick cover during the day, if he wasn't already nocturnal by nature. When I say thick cover, I mean too thick or nasty for a man to walk through, or nearly so. He'd find the area with the least human activity if it's all cover or no cover. He might zig and zag with some pressure for a while, but I believe he'll soon learn where he doesn't have to play that game, and go there.
[/QUOTE]
I'll tell you what he'd do in my area...Speaking of a buck of at least 2 1/2, he'd learn to sit tight in thick cover during the day, if he wasn't already nocturnal by nature. When I say thick cover, I mean too thick or nasty for a man to walk through, or nearly so. He'd find the area with the least human activity if it's all cover or no cover. He might zig and zag with some pressure for a while, but I believe he'll soon learn where he doesn't have to play that game, and go there.
37.) Wild Bob - 08/26/2014
Congrats! Good luck! :tu:
38.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;23676].. He might zig and zag with some pressure for a while, but I believe he'll soon learn where he doesn't have to play that game, and go there.[/QUOTE]
Of course, there's pressure and then there's pressure. Even using the extreme example of dog drives, there's no doubt deer move back into an area that's just been pressured within a day or two, if they even left it. Do you want to still-hunt in there? Nope. Not if you have a choice, anyway. (It's not impossible, though.)
In some ways, I think human intrusion is a bit more for the deer to process than dogs are, so I tend to think we're not getting away with anything no matter how stealthy we are on a scouting expedition or a stand-hanging trip.
Of course, there's pressure and then there's pressure. Even using the extreme example of dog drives, there's no doubt deer move back into an area that's just been pressured within a day or two, if they even left it. Do you want to still-hunt in there? Nope. Not if you have a choice, anyway. (It's not impossible, though.)
In some ways, I think human intrusion is a bit more for the deer to process than dogs are, so I tend to think we're not getting away with anything no matter how stealthy we are on a scouting expedition or a stand-hanging trip.
39.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;23676]but I believe he'll soon learn where he doesn't have to play that game, and go there.[/QUOTE]
Now we're getting somewhere. So you do believe that if pressured enough, they will leave the area. I don't think they do that here.
The area I'm hunting now, where I'm getting the scouting pictures from, is a good example. It is a 200 acre 8 yr old clearcut along the side of the Michaux State Forest. This is big woods country, no open fields, no scouting from the truck with binos. There is distant farmland but nothing close by that I believe they would travel to, except maybe during the stresses of Winter. These deer receive a good amount of pressure along the outside edge of this clearcut. Even in the center, along the bottom of the mountain, there is a logging road running through, and there is evidence of rifle hunters hunting along it, watching whatever openings they can find or intersections of the old drag roads.
These deer have setup shop square in the middle of the thick stuff. I have made a few places to bowhunt that I'm looking to try out this year. I've setup a camera here before and there has been deer here since the clearcut got thick. I don't believe these deer are going to leave this area no matter how many times you walked through here. They will move around you and go right back where they came from.
Same thing happened in the laurel thickets I've hunted in the past. They don't freak out because someone comes through, just do your zig and zag and go right back where they came from. 99% of the time you don't even know they were there.
I don't believe my scouting trips are any different. They let me go by and duck around me. These deer are ALREADY on high alert. Probably were born that way, programmed from their mothers who were already pressured. I suppose I can understand the value of a sanctuary, but in my case the whole dern area is a sanctuary. I'm not too worried about skipping part of the 200 acres.
Because I have walked everywhere over the last 3 years, I've finally narrowed down a portion to what is a predictable bedding area. That is where my camera is this year, and I've identified over 12 different buck using this area. I don't think they are going all that far. They will split up and some will remain nocturnal. Hopefully one or two of the mature ones will walk around looking for a doe in Nov.
So....I don't know what the hell I'm saying anymore because I've been typing so long.......but in summary.........you are wrong.:wink:tu:
Now we're getting somewhere. So you do believe that if pressured enough, they will leave the area. I don't think they do that here.
The area I'm hunting now, where I'm getting the scouting pictures from, is a good example. It is a 200 acre 8 yr old clearcut along the side of the Michaux State Forest. This is big woods country, no open fields, no scouting from the truck with binos. There is distant farmland but nothing close by that I believe they would travel to, except maybe during the stresses of Winter. These deer receive a good amount of pressure along the outside edge of this clearcut. Even in the center, along the bottom of the mountain, there is a logging road running through, and there is evidence of rifle hunters hunting along it, watching whatever openings they can find or intersections of the old drag roads.
These deer have setup shop square in the middle of the thick stuff. I have made a few places to bowhunt that I'm looking to try out this year. I've setup a camera here before and there has been deer here since the clearcut got thick. I don't believe these deer are going to leave this area no matter how many times you walked through here. They will move around you and go right back where they came from.
Same thing happened in the laurel thickets I've hunted in the past. They don't freak out because someone comes through, just do your zig and zag and go right back where they came from. 99% of the time you don't even know they were there.
I don't believe my scouting trips are any different. They let me go by and duck around me. These deer are ALREADY on high alert. Probably were born that way, programmed from their mothers who were already pressured. I suppose I can understand the value of a sanctuary, but in my case the whole dern area is a sanctuary. I'm not too worried about skipping part of the 200 acres.
Because I have walked everywhere over the last 3 years, I've finally narrowed down a portion to what is a predictable bedding area. That is where my camera is this year, and I've identified over 12 different buck using this area. I don't think they are going all that far. They will split up and some will remain nocturnal. Hopefully one or two of the mature ones will walk around looking for a doe in Nov.
So....I don't know what the hell I'm saying anymore because I've been typing so long.......but in summary.........you are wrong.:wink:tu:
40.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
It's pretty much impossible to kill a deer anyway, is what I'm saying, but I'll go ahead and read your post now just to say I did it. :wink
41.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23680]....So....I don't know what the hell I'm saying anymore because I've been typing so long.......but in summary.........you are wrong.:wink:tu:[/QUOTE]
It's pretty much impossible to kill a deer anyway, is what I'm saying, but I'll go ahead and read your whole post now just to say I did it. :wink
It's pretty much impossible to kill a deer anyway, is what I'm saying, but I'll go ahead and read your whole post now just to say I did it. :wink
42.) bluecat - 08/26/2014
I think I just figured it out. While you guys are pontificating, smoking pipes and making squiggly lines on maps of bedding areas, travel routes and food plots, other people are out killing deer.
43.) bluecat - 08/26/2014
:wink
44.) DParker - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;23675][COLOR="#FF0000"]I don't know about you, but I came here for an argument. :wink[/COLOR][/QUOTE]
No you didn't. You came here for an [I]argument[/I].
[video=youtube_share;6sdVx5gQz6w]http://youtu.be/6sdVx5gQz6w[/video]
No you didn't. You came here for an [I]argument[/I].
[video=youtube_share;6sdVx5gQz6w]http://youtu.be/6sdVx5gQz6w[/video]
45.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23680]Now we're getting somewhere. So you do believe that if pressured enough, they will leave the area. I don't think they do that here. [/QUOTE]
If we're only talking 2-300 acres, yes, I do believe they can be pushed out of an area (at least temporarily) if they don't have to be there for reasons of food and security. I don't think that's likely in the area you describe if you are being at least somewhat low-impact.
But I don't think leaving the area is the real issue. Putting the deer on alert is.
I have no doubt you know how to avoid mucking up a 200-acre donut hole. I'd just rather hunt deer on the edge of it that never knew I existed than ones who had learned how to do the Luv2 Shuffle. :wink
Mmmm...donuts...
If we're only talking 2-300 acres, yes, I do believe they can be pushed out of an area (at least temporarily) if they don't have to be there for reasons of food and security. I don't think that's likely in the area you describe if you are being at least somewhat low-impact.
But I don't think leaving the area is the real issue. Putting the deer on alert is.
I have no doubt you know how to avoid mucking up a 200-acre donut hole. I'd just rather hunt deer on the edge of it that never knew I existed than ones who had learned how to do the Luv2 Shuffle. :wink
Mmmm...donuts...
46.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=bluecat;23684]I think I just figured it out. While you guys are pontificating, smoking pipes and making squiggly lines on maps of bedding areas, travel routes and food plots, other people are out killing deer.[/QUOTE]
:-)
Quick, somebody find that diagram of the man-drive we're gonna do when we all finally get together...I remember I was supposed to walk toward the big rock, and Crookedeye was supposed to do a buttonhook...
:-)
Quick, somebody find that diagram of the man-drive we're gonna do when we all finally get together...I remember I was supposed to walk toward the big rock, and Crookedeye was supposed to do a buttonhook...
47.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=Swamp Fox;23687]But I don't think leaving the area is the real issue. Putting the deer on alert is.[/QUOTE]
And maybe that is the real issue. How do we quantify that and how do we know when we've 'changed' them in a negative way? Just from the stories of the dozens and dozens of PA hunters that I talk too, I think they already have changed.
I don't believe it is the same as it used to be, at least it 'appears' to me that the deer have somehow become more nocturnal in general. Maybe it is because we're hunting a lot of older deer compared to what we hunted here in the 70's and 80's.
Heaven knows they are much harder to see now than they used to be. My efforts haven't changed much. If anything, I am more stealthy and scent free now. Most bowhunters I know would say the same thing.
So when does all the activity become 'too much'?
If only the Drury twins would get on here and enlighten us.
And maybe that is the real issue. How do we quantify that and how do we know when we've 'changed' them in a negative way? Just from the stories of the dozens and dozens of PA hunters that I talk too, I think they already have changed.
I don't believe it is the same as it used to be, at least it 'appears' to me that the deer have somehow become more nocturnal in general. Maybe it is because we're hunting a lot of older deer compared to what we hunted here in the 70's and 80's.
Heaven knows they are much harder to see now than they used to be. My efforts haven't changed much. If anything, I am more stealthy and scent free now. Most bowhunters I know would say the same thing.
So when does all the activity become 'too much'?
If only the Drury twins would get on here and enlighten us.
48.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
They would probably say it's all a matter of degree. :re:
But where's the fun in that? That's like limiting the debate about how many angels can dance on the head of a pin to finite numbers.
But where's the fun in that? That's like limiting the debate about how many angels can dance on the head of a pin to finite numbers.
49.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
I'm scouting the far side of the clearcut next weekend, an area I've avoided until now. They will be confused by my tactics....no?
This should be a fascinating read for the night shift. There is still a night shift...isn't there?
This should be a fascinating read for the night shift. There is still a night shift...isn't there?
50.) bluecat - 08/26/2014
You could confuse them more by running away...
51.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
Should throw in here. If setting up the cameras is any indication (it may or may not be) it takes at least 24-36 hrs before things settle down and pictures begin to pop up on a regular basis. I've been keeping track of that for the last 7-8 yrs.
I have it all written down at home somewhere if you want to read it.:wink
I have it all written down at home somewhere if you want to read it.:wink
52.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
I'd like to see [I]Deer and Deer Hunting [/I]come out with a formula like
(C+1)
--------- = TM
2
Where C equals contact with deer and TM equals Too Much....
That would be about their speed...It would be a more complicated formula if it were [I]InFisherman.[/I]
(C+1)
--------- = TM
2
Where C equals contact with deer and TM equals Too Much....
That would be about their speed...It would be a more complicated formula if it were [I]InFisherman.[/I]
53.) bluecat - 08/26/2014
Have you considered tea leaves or the ouija board?
54.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=luv2bowhunt;23693]Should throw in here. If setting up the cameras is any indication (it may or may not be) it takes at least 24-36 hrs before things settle down and pictures begin to pop up on a regular basis. I've been keeping track of that for the last 7-8 yrs.
I have it all written down at home somewhere if you want to read it.:wink[/QUOTE]
LOL..In the woods, I'd say that's about right. Elsewhere, I can get pics on food of any type almost immediately. I'd have to think about a lick in the woods that went out before the camera did, though. [COLOR="#FF0000"]Feeders in the woods get pics same day as the camera was set as long as the deer have already found the feeder.[/COLOR]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Red ink = Edit[/COLOR]
I have it all written down at home somewhere if you want to read it.:wink[/QUOTE]
LOL..In the woods, I'd say that's about right. Elsewhere, I can get pics on food of any type almost immediately. I'd have to think about a lick in the woods that went out before the camera did, though. [COLOR="#FF0000"]Feeders in the woods get pics same day as the camera was set as long as the deer have already found the feeder.[/COLOR]
[COLOR="#FF0000"]Red ink = Edit[/COLOR]
55.) luv2bowhunt - 08/26/2014
Oh yeah forgot. Hey billy congrats on that permit thing. If I shoot a bigger one than you, you'll never hear the end of it. It will be all I talk about on here for a year or two. Might even stretch it out for a decade if we both live that long.:beer:
56.) Swamp Fox - 08/26/2014
[QUOTE=bluecat;23695]Have you considered tea leaves or the ouija board?[/QUOTE]
Are you kidding? I couldn't even get the "2" to go in the middle under the division line.
This is why I like my Magic 8 Ball...The science, math and technology is minimal...
Are you kidding? I couldn't even get the "2" to go in the middle under the division line.
This is why I like my Magic 8 Ball...The science, math and technology is minimal...